2017 YFZ450r knocking hard with less than 20 hrs - Yamaha YFZ450 Forum : YFZ450, YFZ450R, YFZ450X Forums
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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 10:04 AM Thread Starter
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2017 YFZ450r knocking hard with less than 20 hrs

My 2017 YFZ450r sounds like the rod bearing blew. bike has 20 hrs on it if that. For performance the bike has fmf 4.1 full exhaust and a vortex tuner map5- 6,6,7. I've changed the oil 3x already. air filter before every ride. oil is saturated and over filled with gas. Was full to the brim when I checked the oil. so fuel is leaking into the engine somehow. I noticed that after sitting over night the bike would take 5 or 6 seconds to start vs starting up instantly like when it was new or after riding it. It would only blow black smoke when you first started it. After riding if I let it sit and idle and revved it. no black smoke....something is leading me to think I have a stuck open fuel injector or a leaky one when the bike is sitting... or have a hole in my piston. anyone have any ideas or experience a similar issue before?

2017 YFZ450R LE
FMF Factory 4.1 full system
Vortex ECU
GYTR Nerf Bars
DWT Beedlocks
18" razor cross MX tires
Houser +1 steering stem


2015 YFZ450r (FOR SALE)
completely stock asking ($5900)


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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 10:18 AM
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Did you dyno tune it

2016 YFZ450R - Curtis sparks pipe, FCI w/box, Vortex,hiper tech 3 dual rear beadlocks/non beadlocks fronts,razr mx rears/cross fronts,13 cable holder for ais delete,acerbis handguards,alba parking brake block off
2004 mx yfz-sparks,houser,Walsh,fullbore,esr,lonestar,tcs,maxx is tag,dwt,powermadd,quadtech more
2002 flat track banshee-toomey,trinity,janssen,lonestar,works,American racer ,v force and more
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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 10:59 AM Thread Starter
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Did you dyno tune it


no I set it to what the guy from Duncan (I believe that's where I got it from) recommended

2017 YFZ450R LE
FMF Factory 4.1 full system
Vortex ECU
GYTR Nerf Bars
DWT Beedlocks
18" razor cross MX tires
Houser +1 steering stem


2015 YFZ450r (FOR SALE)
completely stock asking ($5900)


2007 KX450f
Too much to list
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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 11:52 AM
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Wrong map for 3 mod bike...map 9 per Leonard's instructions....Sounds like your engine issues and tune issues aren't related.......Are you under warranty? Remove goodies and take it to a dealer. If not under warranty pull the head and see what is going on.

Curious how did you break it in? Heat cycles and varying engine rpms or ride it like you stole it?


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Last edited by kilroy; 05-11-2017 at 11:57 AM.
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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 04:04 PM Thread Starter
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Wrong map for 3 mod bike...map 9 per Leonard's instructions....Sounds like your engine issues and tune issues aren't related.......Are you under warranty? Remove goodies and take it to a dealer. If not under warranty pull the head and see what is going on.

Curious how did you break it in? Heat cycles and varying engine rpms or ride it like you stole it?


Correction, I am using map 3 5,6,7


As far as break in. I did the proper break in as recommended by the dealer. I may be wrong but in no way should a stock engine let go like that and fill the oil with gas with so little hrs on the bike. If so I'm going back to an LTR lol. I had hundreds of hrs on my 08 LTR with one rebuild and had the transmission redone once. By Glenn Shlude and I rode the absolute piss out of that thing.

2017 YFZ450R LE
FMF Factory 4.1 full system
Vortex ECU
GYTR Nerf Bars
DWT Beedlocks
18" razor cross MX tires
Houser +1 steering stem


2015 YFZ450r (FOR SALE)
completely stock asking ($5900)


2007 KX450f
Too much to list
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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 05:11 PM
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I've had a racing acquaintance that had to rebuild a new 2014 after about 25 hours. He said his piston was slapping. I'm not sure if maybe you both got a "monday" quad or what. That sucks. I'd march into Yamaha dealer and nicely voice your frustration and then ask who you can talk to up the corporate chain to make this right.
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Ride it like your health insurance deductible has been met!
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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 05:31 PM
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2017 YFZ450r knocking hard with less than 20 hrs

I don't think it's anything wrong with the mechanical part of the engine, but change the oil ASAP... But I would check the fuel pressure regulator first, then take your throttle body off and look for something obvious... Because it runs good once it cleared out forget about the hole in piston or rings. back in the carb days it would almost for sure be a stuck float ...as far as the engine noise goes it's probably trying to compress fluid in the combustion chamber ...unless the thin oil caused a bearing failure...And of coarse if its still under warranty take it to the dealer

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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 08:57 PM
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I've been dealing with the Vortex since May of 2014 and Map 9 is the one you want for a three mod bike.....You still have the wrong map! My bike has been dynoed by the way! Many many others .....to many to count are running map 9 and I talked with Leonard about two weeks ago trouble shooting something for a friend and he once again told me that Map 9 is the one you want....130 hours on my original motor and it runs like brand new!


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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 09:06 PM
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2017 YFZ450r knocking hard with less than 20 hrs

Bad tuning shouldn't allow gas to seep into the crankcase with the engine off, I'm not that knowledgeable about EFI yet , but without a float bowl it must somehow be siphon feeding from the tank? ... Weird, I'm curious what could cause that
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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-11-2017, 09:20 PM
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If he rode it like he stole it from break-in......Or Yamaha could've simply blew it?


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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 06:57 AM
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My map 9 is a high compression map and my map 1 is the power map for stock motor with the 3 mods
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 09:08 AM
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So does this thing still run good after warm up....or is it messed up all the time now?

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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 09:52 AM Thread Starter
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So does this thing still run good after warm up....or is it messed up all the time now?


The bike has always ran fine. just took about 5 or 6 seconds of cranking to start after sitting over night and if the bike was reved it would blow black smoke at first. I did notice that it actually idled kind of high. easily 1100-1200 rpms at idle instead of probably like 750 like it should be. But as of right now the engine is shot, it has a very bad crank nock in it.

2017 YFZ450R LE
FMF Factory 4.1 full system
Vortex ECU
GYTR Nerf Bars
DWT Beedlocks
18" razor cross MX tires
Houser +1 steering stem


2015 YFZ450r (FOR SALE)
completely stock asking ($5900)


2007 KX450f
Too much to list
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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 10:45 AM
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Might be getting too much fuel if your revving it and get black smoke

2016 YFZ450R - Curtis sparks pipe, FCI w/box, Vortex,hiper tech 3 dual rear beadlocks/non beadlocks fronts,razr mx rears/cross fronts,13 cable holder for ais delete,acerbis handguards,alba parking brake block off
2004 mx yfz-sparks,houser,Walsh,fullbore,esr,lonestar,tcs,maxx is tag,dwt,powermadd,quadtech more
2002 flat track banshee-toomey,trinity,janssen,lonestar,works,American racer ,v force and more

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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by atvman8351 View Post
My map 9 is a high compression map and my map 1 is the power map for stock motor with the 3 mods
Those instructions are incorrect......How many people do you want me to produce who have had their bikes dynoed? Like I said I am one of the most experienced people with the Vortex on this site...I just spoke with Leonard Duncan and was told ALL Vortex maps for 09-17 are identical......Map 9, 5, 6, 6 was the recommended starting point for a three mod bike at any altitude on pump gas....Make sure your TPS has been set properly before you tune.....Ctown208 has extensive knowledge on the Vortex software if you're curious....

I can't offer you info on your knocking problems unless I could see it in person.

Per the manufacturer heat cycles and varrying engine rpm should of been the way you ran it for the first few hours for break in....I can post a video if you would like if you don't believe me.... ;)

Sounds like the rest of your maintenance is good!

Hint see the left upper corner....lots of posts and I've been on Central for a fairly long time.......


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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 11:16 AM Thread Starter
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Those instructions are incorrect......How many people do you won't me to produce who have had their bikes dynoed? Like I said I am one of the most experienced people with the Vortex on this site...I just spoke with Leonard Duncan and was told ALL Vortex maps for 09-17 are identical......Map 9, 5, 6, 6 was the recommended starting point for a three modes bike at any altitude on pump gas....Make sure your TPS has been set properly before you tune.....

I can't offer you info on your knocking problems...

Per the manufacturer heat cycles and varrying engine rpm should of been the way you ran it for the first few hours for break in....I can post a video if you would like if you don't believe me.... ;)

Sounds like the rest of your maintenance is good!

Hint see the left upper corner....lots of posts and I've been on Central for a fairly long time.......



I would say I did a fairly good job breaking the engine in and this is by no means my first time breaking in a new motor. And I have never had an issue like this. Sucks I have to wait till the 23rd for the dealer to look at it though....
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2017 YFZ450R LE
FMF Factory 4.1 full system
Vortex ECU
GYTR Nerf Bars
DWT Beedlocks
18" razor cross MX tires
Houser +1 steering stem


2015 YFZ450r (FOR SALE)
completely stock asking ($5900)


2007 KX450f
Too much to list
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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 12:11 PM
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im sure it was using gasoline as a lubricant that fried your bearings...I take its not under warranty , wish I knew more about the EFI system to help you...whatever acts like the float is not working, its allowing gas to seep into the motor... just curious, did that gas -oil mix make its way into the airbox ?
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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by kilroy View Post
Those instructions are incorrect......How many people do you want me to produce who have had their bikes dynoed? Like I said I am one of the most experienced people with the Vortex on this site...I just spoke with Leonard Duncan and was told ALL Vortex maps for 09-17 are identical......Map 9, 5, 6, 6 was the recommended starting point for a three mod bike at any altitude on pump gas....Make sure your TPS has been set properly before you tune.....Ctown208 has extensive knowledge on the Vortex software if you're curious....

I can't offer you info on your knocking problems unless I could see it in person.

Per the manufacturer heat cycles and varrying engine rpm should of been the way you ran it for the first few hours for break in....I can post a video if you would like if you don't believe me.... ;)

Sounds like the rest of your maintenance is good!

Hint see the left upper corner....lots of posts and I've been on Central for a fairly long time.......
I am so glad I had a few minutes to read this. So last weekend A guy that also distributes for vortex told me that there is secret map 11. On this map you can run your quad on leaves off the trees. So you never have to go back to the truck for fuel. A by product of the leaf combustion is an exhaust gas that also reverses climate change.


How can a distributor of thousands of products know more than a manufacturer that specializes in these things?
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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilroy View Post
Those instructions are incorrect......How many people do you want me to produce who have had their bikes dynoed? Like I said I am one of the most experienced people with the Vortex on this site...I just spoke with Leonard Duncan and was told ALL Vortex maps for 09-17 are identical......Map 9, 5, 6, 6 was the recommended starting point for a three mod bike at any altitude on pump gas....Make sure your TPS has been set properly before you tune.....Ctown208 has extensive knowledge on the Vortex software if you're curious....

I can't offer you info on your knocking problems unless I could see it in person.

Per the manufacturer heat cycles and varrying engine rpm should of been the way you ran it for the first few hours for break in....I can post a video if you would like if you don't believe me.... ;)

Sounds like the rest of your maintenance is good!

Hint see the left upper corner....lots of posts and I've been on Central for a fairly long time.......
Kilroy I respect all the time and info you put out for everyone but why would the manufacturer send the wrong info out with their product is it possible that it did change and Leonard isn't aware or something like that it says on the bottom of the chart all the changes to the maps over time I'm not arguing just throwing it out there

2016 YFZ450R - Curtis sparks pipe, FCI w/box, Vortex,hiper tech 3 dual rear beadlocks/non beadlocks fronts,razr mx rears/cross fronts,13 cable holder for ais delete,acerbis handguards,alba parking brake block off
2004 mx yfz-sparks,houser,Walsh,fullbore,esr,lonestar,tcs,maxx is tag,dwt,powermadd,quadtech more
2002 flat track banshee-toomey,trinity,janssen,lonestar,works,American racer ,v force and more
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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-12-2017, 03:15 PM Thread Starter
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im sure it was using gasoline as a lubricant that fried your bearings...I take its not under warranty , wish I knew more about the EFI system to help you...whatever acts like the float is not working, its allowing gas to seep into the motor... just curious, did that gas -oil mix make its way into the airbox ?

I agree with you. that's what me and a few ppl who work on these things are thinking. that or the piston some how cracked or has a hole in it.. I will check the airbox and see. But the bike has the 5 year extended warranty on it. so it should be covered. the dealer said bring the receipt for oil and that's all they need. According to the owners manual the bike is due for its first service at 20hrs. I don't even think it has 20 hrs on it tbh... id say closer to 15. so as far as I'm concerned I shouldn't even need an oil receipt. I'm just anal about my oil and filter changes and do them every time I ride all day. I haven't touched the engine besides maintenance. and no way an exhaust and vortex tuner caused this issue.

2017 YFZ450R LE
FMF Factory 4.1 full system
Vortex ECU
GYTR Nerf Bars
DWT Beedlocks
18" razor cross MX tires
Houser +1 steering stem


2015 YFZ450r (FOR SALE)
completely stock asking ($5900)


2007 KX450f
Too much to list
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